Visco Fuse Machine

[mr.stijntje]

Pirate, when not in flashes, Al doesn't burn as fast as you think, even Bp with Mg doesn't burn much faster, just produces more light and sparks.

[Blaf]

Stijntje, you're right about burn properties of Al. Indeed, this fuse produces some more sparks and consequently heat. That's it.
Pirate, you've got right picture - there is a funnel on top of whole construction with 3mm bottom hole. This is problem with all such machines I believe and there are two solutions to unreliable mixture flow. First, one can make that bottom hole larger - then you get too much powder on top of die and it spills around like mad. If you can live with that it's OK. Second, artificial vibration could be implemented (small hole remains) but there we have problem with reliable vibration controll to prevent overspill again. Solution is somewhere in between. But for now, I just watch what's happening in upper die and if the pile of powder goes low I tap and shake brass rod which holds the funnel and it works so far.
OK, I agree - it's time to post images. Low heat, heh?

Blaf

[the antverpian pirate]

Ah I didn't know that I thought it also maked the mix burn a bit faster.
Learned something again thanks :wink:

Pirate

[the antverpian pirate]

Ah, great you agree to post images.
Because I'm really curious on how it looks, if I look at the other Machines you've build they all look like they came directly from a mechanical shop :wink:
And also then I can have an idea or it will be possible to build it myself although I don't think I have neither the skill nor material to do it myself.
But it never hurts to have the knowledge or to try and build it.

Pirate

[Blaf]

Images should be here on sunday morning. Sorry, in fact one image or perhaps two. Further ones will be posted at request depicturing specific details as to clearly show how it works.

Blaf

[Blaf]

The Pyro Community should be aware of the fact that my Fuse Machine has been assembled for some time and set in motion for the first time two weeks ago. It worked good. Note this – good but not perfect. The whole construction is physically robust, nice looking and can withstand moderately rough handling. This version of the machine is powered by 24V DC fan motor taken out from an old truck...eventhough the voltage applied is only 12V it still has enough force to spin the mechanism with no problem. However, I have to point out several critical points:

1. Yarns tension. If they're loose, they sometimes (by some miracle) bulge. I haven't solved it yet but will very soon. First I should make my own spools, custom sized for my little machine and then play with tension controll.
2. Pull consistency. Collecting drum where the fuse is to be wound should rotate at constant speed. I resolved this by applying separate motor with gear box which rolls the rubber drum at constant speed regardless of main voltage changes.
3. Powder flow. Meal works perfectly but has worst flow properties. Fine granulated BP flows better but burns quicker. I tried to mix my meal with powdered starch which improved powder flow but burning got slower and unreliable. Therefore I used meal but had to shake powder funnel constantly...and it worked. A bit messier but worked. This matter needs further elaboration.
4. NC lacquer application. For now, this step is being made in separate process as real time application calls for far more space and perhaps forced flow of warm air. I've already made a small jig (see NC application topic) with brass pulleys which has to be submerged into NC solution and tried it just this morning. It worked OK...with little adjustment.

These are only a few of must do refinements. Others are mostly of cosmetic nature and should be left to owners preference. Just to name one – powder dies (there are two of them, upper one is real powder die while lower one is only yarns guide. Conical cavity on upper die could be wider so that yarns travel through the powder longer)...mine are made of wooden dowel pieces 20mm in diameter...could be made of aluminium, brass, or else. Yarn guides between spools and powder die (made of brass wire) could be mounted as to force each yarn to enter its recess at same angle...at least I will do that. Also, yarns should be pure cotton so they burn off completely and in whitish colour so that fuse can be died in whatever colour the end user prefers. Too much theory but no images, heh? I'm just getting you ready for Technological Shock that you're going to experience for sure...so take tranqulizer pills and sit comfortably. Glass of water and a few sugar-cubes could be handy too...
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You see some finished fuse being collected on rubber drum powered by separate motor. Sorry for that green plastic crocodile holding it...
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The same construction from back side. Big green granate-looking cylinder is main 24V DC motor. The whole system could have been powered by the same motor but it required excessive usage of brain cells...so I quickly gave up.

Blaf

[mr.stijntje]

I just don't know what to say
Its.... COOL

It just looks perfect!
I suppose you're very good at working with metal!

nice work Blaf 8)

[Blaf]

Thanks Stijntje...
Here is the burn test of the BP/Al variation. It isn't as spectacular as you might expected, but here it is, burning even under water.
<a href=http://members.pyroforum.nl/Blaf/BurnTestAl.JPG target=_blank><img src=http://members.pyroforum.nl/Blaf/BurnTestAl.JPG width=360 border=0></a href>

Blaf

[the antverpian pirate]

Ah there is the Machine.
It realy looks very nice :wink:

I dont know how its called in english but in dutch its called a "wormwiel" and its used for transferring the "power" of a vertical shaft to a horizontal. Maybe you can use something like that if you want to power the Machine with one motor.
Here is a link to a site where there is a picture of such a wheel.
http://www.ibsrotterdam.nl/PSL.htm
This is a complicated version of it but you also have other versions for other aplications.

And maybe if it's possible you could use a longer vertical power shaft and add a litle round wheel on top with rubber flaps on the sides
so that the flaps hit the brass shaft witch holds the funnel and create vibrations while doing so or is this just a ridiculous idea?
The only thing would be that it hits the shaft right next to the frame so maybe that won't be sufficient to vibrate the funnel.
But if you add another "wormwiel" you can make another shaft so you can let the wheel with flaps come right next to the funnel.
But then, of course, you have to alter the frame of the Machine so it might be too much trouble so with some more thought about it there might be another way.

And that fuse does look nice and it's always useful if it burns under water, if it starts raining or so.

Pirate

[Blaf]

Yes, I can see the picture, rubber wings flapping the brass rod and thus producing vibrations. There's strong possibility that there would be too much vibration applied regardless on where those flaps hit the rod. Some sort of flow controll should be applied right at the exit hole of the funnel, sort of mechanical detector. Don't know yet how to build one but it would be nice to have it in action.
As for that drive you mentioned, I think english version is Wormwheel or something, I know what you mean and if I ever come accross one I'll probably set it in somewhere.

Blaf

[Pretty green flames]

Blaf, could you please get a couple of pictures of the part where the fuse get's it's first layer of yarn, if possible.

Thanks

[Blaf]

PGF, I'll do that but images will be posted from Zagreb since I go there tomorrow morning and will stay there for a week or so. I should remember to take photos when I come home this evening.

Blaf

[Blaf]

Here are images you requested PGF. Upper die is made of wood as you can see but works OK. Recesses are cut with a tiny saw used by model makers and serve well too. Maybe, but just maybe, upper die could be made wider and inner angle of it could be even steeper so that collection of powder is more efficient. Wider die would prevent powder spills too.
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Here you can see detail where first 12 threaded yarns enter the lower die where they meet further 8 counterwound yarns.
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Hope this helps a bit PGF.

Blaf

[Pretty green flames]

Thanks a lot for the pics.

[Blaf]

Here's another image...the newest production sample!

<a href=http://members.pyroforum.nl/Blaf/FuseCol.JPG target=_blank><img src=http://members.pyroforum.nl/Blaf/FuseCol.JPG width=360 border=0></a href>

This time I used pure cotton yarns but I could find coloured ones only. I don't mind because it doesn't affect fuse properties. It comes out even thinner than before.

Blaf

[mr.stijntje]

It's very nice Blaf, almost looks like commercial visco! (because of that green color )

[Moloch]

I should seriously start to consider making one of these. I think it's just a hell of a job to get the plan exacly right. Your's looks absolutely perfect! How much visco does it produce/min?(including you tapping the MP thing ).

One que. about the upper 12 strings. If they go into the wood pard, how do you make them twist into eachother? Cause you can't turn the whole thing (with the 12 strings on top) because it will get twisty and all. How did you make that work?

[Blaf]

Here I am to throw some light...

As for production speed, I don't really need high output and turn it on only occasionally. But generally, collecting drum turns at one revolution in 2,5 – 3 sec. One full turn collects about 10cm of fuse....now you can calculate that my machine makes about 2m of fuse in one minute. That's rough estimation as I can increase voltage so that production is even quicker than that.
As for waiving problem, it is not really a problem because it happens due to friction. See, upper powder die has a tiny hole of 1,5mm, upper 12 threads go through it, they're being collected into thin train which goes down into the bottom die (where additional 8 threads are being collected and wound around first 12) which turns in oposite direction! As both holes are just sufficiently wide to let 12 (upper - 1,5mm) and 20 (lower - 2mm) yarns through, the first spiral waiving of upper 12 yarns happens just between upper and lower die - between their holes, respectively. Waiving of lower 8 yarns around first 12 ones happens between lower die and small plastic pulley just below it. Hope I cleared it up for you a bit...

Blaf

[Moloch]

which turns in oposite direction!

I'm very sorry for not understanding this machine, but I don't get the "turning in opposite direction" thing...I know the collector drum is rotating, but are the 8 strings turning as well? Could you post a vid, or is that not possible?

Thanks for your help so far!

[Blaf]

Ah, words of Wisdom...thanks SoulPredator.
Moloch, he's right about those plastic discs (maybe I should have pointed it out earlier)...all in all I hope you got the picture now.

Blaf

[Moloch]

Great! I see them. Yea, the result would fall apart if it would have been woven all in the same direction! Sorry for boring the hell out of you ppl . And thanks again!

[deadman]

I really hate bringing up old topics, but I also really hate low forum activity. I really wanted to ask a few questions.

First: I know you use everything from your "spare parts box", but if you had to buy everything new or slightly used how much do you think it would cost to make one of these?

Second: How much time did you put into this. With my expert mathematical calculatory I will be able to tell how long it would take myself. In case you were wondering the formula goes- x³(42) -3 and there you have it. X being the amount of hours you spent on it.

Third: I'm sure you could get a buyer easily for one of those, why don't you manufacture for sale? Ebay even?

[Blaf]

Deadman rides again...

By "spare parts box" I ment various crap I had lying around my flat and basement...and believe me, there was (and still is) plenty of that. So, I haven't got any specialized box with spare parts for building Fuse Machine exclusively. It was just a phrase. If you need to buy everything, I estimate you wouldn't spend more than say....30-50 $. This includes main-shaft, bearings, main DC motor, pulleys and belts, base construction etc. Your work is not included, of course.

It would be impossible to estimate time I spent building this toy. But from seeing it first time on the Net and having the Machine finished, there must have been at least two months...which doesn't mean I worked every day on it. I mainly spent my time discussing all aspects with one of my friends (consuming enormous quantity of espresso) while actual assembly lasted not longer than 5-6 hours. The most important is – I never tried to rush things up...if I've had, It would have been done much quicker. So, no straight answer again, sorry.

You should know I've done this from curiosity reasons (See, curiosity doesn't necessarily kill cats but leads sometimes to more elaborate outcome). I had no commercial intentions whatsoever, and I hope it stays like that. Moreover, I invested too much love in process and this machine became like a pet to me. Doing things with heart is never as lucrative as someone might think...

Hope this suffices for some time...

Blaf

[RSDZ]

Hi, I'm trying to design a fuse machine too, I'm not really planning on constructing one yet, but I'm just thinking about it.

But I'm still not sure about the transport (this is what interglot.com gives me as translation for "overbrenging") and the connection of the turning "wheels" to the frame.

EDIT:
I doubt transport is the right word... it's like the connection between 2 wheels or gears.

EDIT:
Things that look like metal (except the bearings) means that I haven't selected a material for them yet, it's because I don't know real parts to use.

[Blaf]

RSDZ, I like your drawings. It is basically the same "In line" design I used with reinforced square frame. By transport you probably mean drive, i.e. the way that pulleys are driven by the main shaft. You could position your main shaft inside (it would require some more drilling through two middle floors) or outside of the main frame. If you ask me, I would do it inside as it makes machine more compact. Collecting drum could be mounted underneath in "ground floor" eventhough there's limited space there...but if you need small quantities of fuse, it could be done quite nice. As far as I can see, roller bearings should be pressed in milled round seats in both floors...that's nice solution and much easier than mine which is more or less supported in the air.
But more than anything, I like the idea that someone else's trying to make The Mighty Machine too...

Blaf